Woody,
I haven't heard anyone suggest standardization and I'm not pushing for it. My whole issue has been freedom so whatever people want to use if fine by me.
At one time, around 2011 I thought the use of different terms by callers might lead to problems but now I don't think that's the case.
Tom
Sent from my iPad
"Living Tradition"
Preserving tradition and being appropriate to our day and age are not
mutually exclusive.
I actually love rich traditions that we keep alive. We talk about "living"
traditions, so what do we mean by this phrase?
For something to be alive, it changes. It adapts. What it doesn't do is
stay stagnant and unchanging. The whole reason contra dancing is still
alive today is because it's alive and changing.
By insisting on holding onto traditions verbatim, we are actually doing
more to kill them than save them. Sure, we'll preserve them this way - as
one does a taxidermied animal: perfectly preserved, sitting on a shelf,
dead.
I'd prefer my traditions alive. I'd like to keep sharing them with younger
generations. That means that people like Rich are asking the right
questions. That means we need to consider that language changes and that we
need to speak in a language that reaches an audience not merely just our
own.
Hey, isn't that the whole point of being a dance caller? Being heard by
your audience?
In dance, again,
Ron Blechner
On Wed, Mar 28, 2018, 1:33 AM Ron Blechner <contraron(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> I want to echo the words of Alex D-L and Dave Casserly.
>
> I'm also appalled at the casual use of the n-word on this thread without
> anyone whatsoever calling it out. This is really giving me pause. :(
>
> Contra's attendance is dwindling - I hear it from every organizer I talk
> to, with a couple exceptions. I also hear about the desire to "get the
> young people to dance". Hmmm.
>
> Ron Blechner
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 27, 2018, 11:39 AM Dave Casserly via Callers <
> callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> Rich,
>>
>> I don't think your situation here is exactly what Colin describes--
>> you're not worried about any of the particular words, as many of us are
>> regarding the word "gypsy," for instance. The question here is whether the
>> phrase has an offensive *meaning* of "women are things," and if so, is
>> that a good reason not to use it. Personally, I'd probably alter it or do
>> a different singing square. I don't subscribe to the extreme position that
>> you should never sing lyrics to a folk song unless you agree with those
>> lyrics; that would make singing folk songs very difficult to do at all.
>> That said, there are some times where the meanings of lyrics are offensive
>> enough, without any redeeming qualities, that I leave a verse out or alter
>> a few words in the singing sessions that I lead. There is nothing
>> sacrosanct about a particular set of lyrics to a folk song; people have
>> been changing them for whatever reason for generations, and will continue
>> to do so. If future singers don't like my revisions, they can sing a
>> different version, just like I sometimes prefer to ignore Victorian-era
>> revisions to bawdier songs.
>>
>> Here, I'd lean toward not using the lyrics for three reasons: 1) they
>> imply that women are objects; 2) there's nothing redeeming or valuable
>> about them, as they're the only things sung, with no context; and 3)
>> similarly, they don't represent the meaning of the song, and when repeated
>> on their own, sort of pervert that meaning (at least going by the lyrics
>> Yoyo posted).
>>
>> I also think there are good reasons to err on the side of inclusive
>> language, particularly in our community. Contra dancing is overwhelmingly
>> white, and for a long time, contra dance calling was dominated by men. The
>> loudest voices on this forum are those of older white men. Contra dancers
>> and particularly organizers are disproportionately white baby boomers.
>> We're seeing the effects of that now; dance attendance has been dwindling
>> as older dancers stop attending and aren't replaced by younger dancers. If
>> we want our dance form to continue to thrive, when there's a question on
>> which there's a generational divide (as you, in my view correctly, note
>> here), I would err toward using the language less likely to turn off our
>> younger generations, which are also our most diverse generations. This
>> isn't an issue where changing the lyrics is going to bother people-- very
>> few would know the original lyrics well enough to notice-- and certainly
>> nobody would know if you selected a different singing square instead.
>>
>> -Dave
>>
>> --
>> David Casserly
>> (cell) 781 258-2761
>> _______________________________________________
>> List Name: Callers mailing list
>> List Address: Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
>> Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/callers@lists.sharedweight.net/
>>
>
Some of you may have known Susan Moffett, who was a dancer and a caller and
a musician (and an artist and a mother and a wife and a friend and a
professor and a teacher in the truest sense). She danced and called dances
in Louisville and the surrounding region.
She was consistently positive and supportive, a great communicator who
modeled so many things for me as a caller and as a human.
Her celebration of life will include both a service and, of course, a
dance, on Saturday, May 19 in Louisville. (Service at 4:30, dance at 8:00).
https://m.legacy.com/obituaries/louisville/obituary.aspx?n=susan-phillips-m…
--Jerome
Jerome Grisanti
660-528-0858
http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
"Whatever you do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius and power
and magic in it." --Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
Hi Sharedweight,
I would like to take a time out from Shareweight. Could you please remove my email address from the forum. My name is Joe De Paolo and my email is jsphdep(a)aol.com
Thank you,
Joe
Hey Rich:
Several replies are of the "it's OK in context" or "that's how things were
back then" variety.
Perhaps.
To use that as the sole argument, however, leads me to a cute little rhyme
my friends and I would sing out when we were about 5 years old and playing
in the yard out on the west coast. It began, "Eenie, meenie, minie, moe..."
I hope no one would suggest that the rhyme in question is fine in this day,
"if only it is put in context."
Granted, your example is a little tamer (in my eyes, but others may find it
equally offensive to the rhyme mentioned; I don't know).
Maybe there are other arguments for retaining the original that stand up
better to true scrutiny. It would be a shame to retain, in common usage
(thereby prolonging the insult), cultural relics that would be unacceptable
in civilized society today.
It would also be a shame to lose past cultural joys.
What about those pop songs that get altered to remove a "derogatory term
for a homosexual" here (Dire Straits) or a "medication usually prescribed
by a physician" there (Meatloaf)?
Where does one draw the line?
Adapt to current mores or die, Relic!
Good luck with that, Rich!
:)
Ken Panton
ps. We have just recently had pass in parliament a change to our national
anthem, to make it gender-neutral, from "in all our sons command" to "in
all of us command". Wasn't THAT a challenge!
Then some smart guy pointed out:
"FYI: The original lyric to the 1908 version of “O Canada” was “Thou dost
in us command.” Was changed to “All Thy Sons” in 1914. So for you
traditionalists, Robert Stanley Weir’s original lyric was, in fact,
gender-neutral."
Hello folks,
I have been calling singing squares for years, and there is one I love by
Dick Leger titled Billy Boy. The tag line that is sung during the
Promenade is "She's a young thing, that cannot leave her mother."
Here is a link to a version of the full song, not within a square.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKRJuLHU3Qo
My question is, is this song appropriate for the contra dance crowd with
the tag line above? (The tag line is the only line that is sung.)
Any Thoughts?
Rich
Stafford, CT
I am an example of someone who gradually left a dance community partly because of what I saw as offensive lyrics in singing calls….. When my wife and I were dancing modern western squares in the late 1980s, in Ohio, many callers were using contemporary pop and country songs for their singing calls. Maybe they still do. One of the reasons we left MWSD after a few years was their choice of country songs for their singing calls (which were about half the dances called in a typical evening). I particularly remember cringing at use of Hank Williams Junior’s song “If the South Woulda Won the War”, which argues that if that had happened we wouldn’t have the social problems we have now (or had in the late ‘80s). Not to belittle the concerns that others have brought up, but there are (or were) a lot more offensive songs available — at least offensive to me — than have been mentioned here. And I am at least half a southerner myself….
I'd make my Supreme Court down in Texas,
And we wouldn't have no killers gettin'off free.
If they were proven guilty, then they would swing quickly,
Instead of writin' books and smilin' on T.V.
We'd all learn Cajun cookin in Louisiana,
And I'd put that capitol back in Alabama.
We'd put Florida on the right track 'cause, we'd take Miami back,
And throw all them pushers in the slammer.
Read more: Hank Williams Jr. - If The South Woulda Won Lyrics | MetroLyrics <http://www.metrolyrics.com/if-the-south-woulda-won-lyrics-hank-williams-jr.…>
Richard Hopkins
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Richard Hopkins
850-544-7614
hopkinsrs(a)comcast.net
I'm the designated caller but my favorite partner-in-crime Laurie Indenbaum
just got freed up to play fiddle and I'd rather make harmonies with her
while one of *you* calls.
The East Putney Dance has been going since forever, is on a dirt road
nobody can find, but people seem to show up any way, has a two-holer
outhouse -- *with padded seats! -- *and a loyal regular crowd big enough to
make two sets, and pays dozens -- dozens, I tell you! -- of dollars.
It's an All-Comers Night which means a bunch of extra musicians will be
sitting in on accordion and harmonica and of course more fiddles, but Carol
Compton keeps them well in line from the piano, and rumor has it a busload
of Putney School teenagers may show up with their exuberance and, um,
creativity.
The dancers will dance ANYthing, contras or circles or singing squares, and
they'll even do dances with clapping and arches without sneering.
If all this sounds impossible to resist, email me directly?
We actually do pay traveling callers somewhat reasonably...
Cheers,
Amy
Passing this along. If someone wants to inquire about a dance *this
Saturday* in Southwest Vermont, you can reach out directly to Liz
Albertson, email below.
In dance,
Ron Blechner
---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Liz Albertson <lizjalbertson(a)gmail.com>
Date: Tue, Mar 20, 2018, 5:22 PM
Subject: Calling a dance 3.24
... was wondering if you are available to call a beginner/family-friendly
dance on March 24th in North Bennington? Thanks, Liz Albertson
Hello
I am devising a workshop for a festival here in Australia, and have long been of the opinion that there are no "leaders" in contra dance couples. Moves should be executed with mutual consent, especially embellishments such as turning under out of a ladies' chain. Conventions such as waltz hold swings are really useful here. In Australia, other related dance forms use a variety of swing holds, which lead to confusion and interruption of flow. I plan to place some emphasis on conventions of holds, such as allemande and star holds.
I would value people's opinions on this, as it may ruffle some long-held conventions. Any words of wisdom from the gender free dance community would be especially welcome.
Also, I believe that if dancers are to enjoy embellishments, they must be by mutual consent. This is so difficult to establish in a microsecond. I would value any thoughts on how to advise reaching this consent in the context of a contra dance.
Looking forward to your thoughts
cheersJeanette
Jeanette Mill
Contra dance caller, musician, workshop facilitator
Canberra, Australia
Phone: +61 (0)449 686 077
Email: jeanette_mill(a)yahoo.com.au
Skype: jeanette.mill
"The piano - 88 little mistakes waiting to happen"Kate Barnes
