Mr. Fuerst, I again think your attempt to inject levity into a conversation
have come across as crass and inappropriate.
Asking about shadow swings on a list for calling is pertinent; joking about
men groping women dancers isn't.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2015 at 2:43 PM, Michael Fuerst via Callers <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
  Asking about how to appropriately do dances with
shadow swings seems like
 asking how men can appropriately grope women during a dance.
 Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801      217 239 5844
 On Tuesday, September 8, 2015 1:41 PM, Michael Fuerst <
 mjerryfuerst(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
 One can also be miffed at having to repeatedly  swing a shadow who one
 finds very pleasant as a person, but just awkward to swing with (too tall,
 too short, distributes his/her weight during a swing in a way that strains
 some part of you).
 Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801      217 239 5844
 On Tuesday, September 8, 2015 1:30 PM, Mac Mckeever via Callers <
 callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
 I agree with Michael - I can't see any reason I would want to call a dance
 with a shadow swing.  If the rest of the dance is that good - modify it to
 get rid of that swing.
 Chances are you are going to make at least one dancer very uncomfortable.
 I avoid any figures that introduce that risk (not a big fan of men's chains
 either).
 There are lots of great dances out there - so I don't see a need to
 knowingly offend dancers with the few dances that contain risky figures.
 Warning them ahead of time creates a very awkward situation on  the floor
 and someone is going to lose.
 Mac McKeever
 ----- Forwarded Message -----
 *From:* Perry Shafran via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net>
 *To:* "callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net" <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net>
 *Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2015 1:20 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
 I'm going to go with Andrea's well-written note on this.  I understand
 that the goal is to prevent people from dancing with people who really make
 them uncomfortable (i.e. creepers).  However, if you suggest "if you need
 to make changes, do so now", that will open up the potential for people to
 refuse a shadow for ANY reason (they smell, they're too fat, they're too
 old, they're not my BFF, they're the same gender, they're a beginner,
 whatever), and that could cause a whole world of hurt - especially in a
 community where we welcome all and celebrate differences in people.  There
 is no graceful way to do this, really, that I can think of.
 For the most part, if there is someone that a person does not want to
 encounter in a dance, much less be a shadow, that person will find a
 different line to dance in.  At least that has been my experience.  Callers
 should not be encouraging people to find someone "better" than the potluck
 shadow that they got.  I would suggest not calling a dance with a shadow
 swing - that would ward off potential problems with shadows people don't
 want to swing and also prevent the hurt that would come with suggesting
 people make changes for whatever reason.
 Perry
 ------------------------------
 *From:* Maia McCormick via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net>
 *To:* "callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net" <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net>
 *Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2015 11:06 AM
 *Subject:* [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
 Hey all,
 First, a disclaimer: Some people on this listserv thing shadow swings are
 problematic. Some don't see any issue with them. This is NOT the
 conversation I want to have in this thread; *I ask that you respond to
 the question I'm asking and do not debate my premise--at least not in this
 particular thread. *This should help keep this thread on track and
 hopefully reduce excess noise and go-nowhere discussions on this listserv.
 Thanks!
 Anyway, the actual question I wanted to ask (whew!)--
 There do exist some really fabulous shadow-swing dances that I would love
 to be able to call, as long as I could do so without putting anyone in an
 uncomfortable position. Do folks have ideas for ways to mitigate the
 potential harms of shadow swing dances? I was considering, at the beginning
 of the dance, having dancers identify their shadow and mentioning, "this
 will be a shadow swing dance, so if you need to make any changes, do so
 now" (or something like that)--haven't gotten the wording down-pat, but the
 idea is giving dancers advance warning of a shadow swing so they can move
 (thereby changing their shadow) if they need to. Any thoughts on this
 method? Suggestions of others?
 Cheers.
 Maia
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-- 
Luke Donforth
Luke.Donforth(a)gmail.com <Luke.Donev(a)gmail.com>