Thanks for the suggestions Clark
I had not considered Lake Shore Farm , that's close to my home ....
Though the floor is a little rough :-)
I will get in touch with them and Mill-Around
Thanks again
Gale
Attn: Callers/ Southern NH
Does anyone know of a hall that can be rented for small dollars
Every other month (or so) . For a Sunday afternoon .
or weekday evening???
(my experience is: halls are hard to come by and expensive
in seacoast NH)
A smaller venue than a normal dance hall will do.
A central location would be great (Concord Area?)
What I am thinking about is doing a callers workshop/open stage
all callers would be welcome!
to try out new (to us) dances and dance moves.
Invite musicians so they can work on new tunes/ jam
Invite local dancers (guinea pigs) to try out dances
I have been to kitchen junckets and those work with a limited
number of dancers.
If all participants chip in a couple of bucks for hall rent it could be
An enjoyable way to work out the kinks in dances and gain some
feed back/experiance.
Something to hash around
Thanks Gale
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To follow Amy Cann's long post recently about choosing dances where the music
fits the phrase...
On the trad-dance-callers list, there recently was a list about Shadrach's
Delight, that classic composition by Tony Parkes. Folks inquired about a good
tune to fit the dance, and someone pointed out that Duke Miller thought that
Aunt May's Canadian Jig was a great fit.
Here is an edited version Tony's comments, oh so relevant to the discussion
we've just been having on this list:
"Incidentally, "Aunt May's Canadian Jig" is a fine tune, but I would not
recommend it for Shad -- at least, not unless the band was willing to play the
low part first. I've always heard it with the high part first, unlike most
fiddle tunes. The problem is that the high part has long, relatively smooth
phrases and the low part has shorter, choppier phrases, while Shadrack has
shorter, choppier moves in the A parts and longer, more flowing moves in the B
parts. ... Another classic Northeastern tune is "The Kitchen Reel." It has a
choppy A and a long, smooth B, and I'd enjoy using it for Shad."
David Millstone
Lebanon, NH
Thank you for a great and timely discussion of how inter-related the calls, the tunes, and the dancers really are... As a new caller, a young-and-gaining-experience dance fiddler, and an I've-been-dancing-for-years dancer who wasn't why some dances were FUN and some were pretty fun and some were okay, I've been trying my darndest to figure out how to match tunes with dances, to create a WOW experience for the dancers... A new way to look at the music, and to play the phrases with a dance card in front of me!
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than "Re: Contents of Callers digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Callers Digest, Vol 37, Issue 6 (Martha Wild)
2. The balance thing. (Amy Cann)
3. Re: The balance thing. (Cynthia Phinney)
4. Re: The balance thing. (Chris Weiler)
5. Re: The balance thing. (David Millstone)
6. Re: The balance thing. (Dan Black)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 20:27:48 -0700
From: Martha Wild
Subject: Re: [Callers] Callers Digest, Vol 37, Issue 6
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
I'd do a nice set of polkas - like the Ballydesmond Polkas. For the
more Old Timey minded, Rock the Cradle Joe or perhaps Grub Springs
could work.
Martha
On Sep 9, 2007, at 9:00 AM, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net wrote:
> Send Callers mailing list submissions to
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> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> callers-request(a)sharedweight.net
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> You can reach the person managing the list at
> callers-owner(a)sharedweight.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Callers digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Can you name these dances? (Jerome Grisanti)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 09:46:50 -0500
> From: "Jerome Grisanti"
> Subject: Re: [Callers] Can you name these dances?
> To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
> Message-ID:
> <78dbc7c60709090746k177d339bpb0d025b15748e934(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Richard,
>
> I have called the dance below (St. Louis dance) but I don't have
> the title
> and author. I danced it in Cincinnati with Kathy Anderson calling. I
> describe the pull-bys in B2 as "square thru two." (Partner balance,
> pull by,
> Neighbor pull by to face next)
>
> Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the
> A1, it
> helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one.
> Musicians?
>
> --Jerome
>
>
> On 9/6/07, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net <
> callers-request(a)sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 13:16:30 -0400
>> From: "Richard Green"
>> Subject: [Callers] Can you name these dances?
>> To:
>> Message-ID:
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>>
>>
>> St Louis Contradance
>>
>> Duple Improper
>>
>> Start wave across, Neighbor by RH, Ladies in center by LH
>>
>> A1 Balance Wave(4), Allemande R 1/2 way(4)
>>
>> Gents Almde L 3/4 to long wave(4), balance wave(4)
>>
>> A2 Gents Almde L 3/4(4), Swing Ptnr(12)
>>
>> ------
>>
>> B1 Ladies Allemande R 1.5(8)
>>
>> Swing Neighbor
>>
>> B2 R to Ptnr, balance(4), pull by Neighbor L(4)
>>
>> Do Si Do New Neighbor, form wave across
>>
>> --
>> Jerome Grisanti
>> 660-528-0858
>> 660-528-0714
>> http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>
>
> End of Callers Digest, Vol 37, Issue 6
> **************************************
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 01:38:48 -0400
From: "Amy Cann"
Subject: [Callers] The balance thing.
To: "Caller's discussion list"
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Dead silence for weeks and then a four page rant?
OK, I'm going to stop lurking and finally jump in. Brace yourself.
>> Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the A1, it
>> helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one.
>> Musicians?
I have never quite understood why *other* musicians want to know where the
balances are.
Sure, it's good to "spike" the balances in my playing, but I can do that
ANYwhere in a tune - and if I can't, I ain't no fiddler.
And sure it's good to know where the balances ARE, but I can get that by
watching the dance - and if I'm not watching the dance, then I ain't no
fiddler.
Let me posit something: what we're really talking about here is LENGTH OF
PHRASE.
The one thing I want to know from a caller: how long are the phrases that
you care about?
The balances often mark the starts or ends of a phrase, but they're not
always the actual issue.
HUH?
OK:
As both a caller and fiddler/pianist, I find with many callers (I'll get
to the exceptions later) that the fastest way to match the tune to the
dance is to say - "hey, can I see that card a sec?"
First, I get to check out everyone else's heiroglyphics, and second, I can
see what's going on faster than anyone could ever explain it to me.
And here's what I'm looking for: where do things stop?
Well, not stop, more like.."gather."
It takes 16 beats to get through an A. This is NOT the same thing as 16
steps. When you step, your weight is passing from one foot to the other.
We take LOTS of steps in contradancing, but what we also get are lots of
GATHERING moments, when we suck our weight together under us.
Circle left = /step step step step /step step step step/ -- IF the next
move is slide-left-along-the-lines.
It also can = /step step step step /step step step GATHER / -- IF the
next thing is going to be balance-the-circle.
Think about it.
Sometimes we gather ourselves, alone; sometimes in pairs, sometimes as a
four person circle or line-of-four, wavy or not, and sometimes as a
whole-room line.
(We usually do this for one of two reasons: because we're about to go the
OTHER way, or because we ARE going to go on, in a moment, in the same
direction, but we're setting up some sort of delayed-gratification thing.)
And often, without that clear gathering moment, the next thing won't work
well.
Think lines-forward-and-back: in some dances the line MUST suck itself
together, snap into formation, BEFORE moving forward, or it won't have
that satisfying clarity.
NOW, tunes have places where they continue and places where they
stop/gather too:
Sometimes they go: deedle-deedle-noodle-noodle-deedle-noodle-doodle-needle
for the whole time.
Sometimes they go: deedle noodle CHUCK, deedle noodle CHUCK, chucka
noodle chucka noodle YA CHA CHA! (hear the stops?)
Another way to think of it: 16 beats could be 123stop 123stop 12345678 or
it could be 1stop12345678910111213 stop or it could be.... you get it.
NOW, the whole reason contradancing stays fresh (this my theory, and just
my theory, but *I* believe it) is because even though the same people come
every week, and the dances have a certain number of moves, and the band
plays a limited number of tunes, the COMBINATION is never the same.
Different partner, different neighbor. Different tune/dance pairing.
Different 4+4 +8 tune layered over 8+2+2+4 dance.
Imagine doing an allemande/balance/allemande/balance sequence to a tune
that stops and starts right along WITH you. It can feel very satisfying,
neatly packaged.
Doing that same sequence while the tune keeps driving onwards? Now there's
a delicious sense of urgency, gotta-catch-up.
The better the dancers/caller/band, the more you can stretch the limits of
that kind of interplay.
HOWEVER, there are places where the dance stops/gathers, and the tune
REALLY needs to do the same.
In a group with lots of beginners, at the beginning of the night, at the
beginning of a medley:
Long-lines-forward -and-back really should have a tune that goes
1-2-3-stop, 1-2-3-stop.
Any place where it's important that couples stop swinging and get on to
the next thing.
Any place where shapes need to quickly coelesce out of thin air, do
something, and then morph quickly into a new clear shape:
Pass thru to ocean wave, Bal line , outside alle R 1/2, Bal line.
Plus specialty moves like bucksaws and zigzags, where everybody needs to
"get THERE, now STAY there, now get THERE" all at the same time or they
get in each other's way.
And there are some tunes with such good built in stops (Joys of Quebec,
the B part) that it's a crying shame to waste them on something sinuous
and connected.
I personally see it graphically. Here's a mythical dance (don't worry who
does what with whom, ok?):
A1: Bal, pull by,
alle L 1ce, alle R next 1ce
A2 Long Lines fwd & back
Swing in center
B1 Down hall lines-of-4
Back, cast off
B2 Chain
R&L back
And here's inside my head:
A // , // , - - - -
- - - -, - - - /
- - - /, - - - /
- - - - - - / /
B - - - - - - / /
- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - -,
- - - - - - - -
The A parts definitely need a tune that comes in groups of 4, or the lines
won't form and the swings will dribble into the down-the hall.
The B part could use a 16-er, if it weren't for the cast off:
since they have to come UP the hall AND cast off in one phrase, they
better do their turning around at the END of the previous 8 bars, and the
band better help them :
Down 2 3 4 TURN as a couple,
UP 2 3 4 cast off get ready to chain.
Time for a French Canadian, or maybe a march. Saut de Lapin would be
perfect.
***
Give me the card, I will pair up the tunes.
Tell me how long the phrases are -- "short and choppy in the A, long and
connected in the B," and I will pair up the tunes.
Give me a description that makes sense to YOU - "I need something that
goes UH uh uh, UH uh uh, digga digga digga digga UH uh uh" and I will grin
and match up the tunes.
Or show me with your hands, or use really good adjectives - sprightly,
brisk, sly -
- or make tune comparisons, " something a lot like La Bastringue, but not."
But tell me where all the balances are? "Beginning of A1, last 2 beats of
A2, third beat of B1 but only for the ones.." and I will smile politely
and say "can I see your card a sec?"
And, God forbid, if you call a dance like my mythical one in a community
hall full of Old-Home-Days beginners, and ask me to play the relentlessly
driving old-time tune you heard Wild Asparagus play at the
advanced-dancers night in the big city? I am gonna LIE to you, tell you I
never heard of that tune, and say, "can I see your card a sec?"
'course, with certain callers, I do EXACTLY what you tell me, 'cause you
already thought all of this out yourself, bless you, and you know who you
are.
I'll be really interested in feedback from all four people who actually
read this whole thing.
Cheers,
Amy Cann
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 07:45:19 -0400
From: "Cynthia Phinney"
Subject: Re: [Callers] The balance thing.
To: "'Caller's discussion list'"
Message-ID: <001901c7f3a0$1067bf20$326412c6@Fiddlewoods2>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Thanks for jumping in Amy. As both a caller and a musician myself (Oh - and
also a dancer, FIRST a dancer, did I mention that) I love your description
of this concept. The GATHER part is not quite the way I'd ever thought about
it before but I can feel it as I read your descriptions. I also like the
length of phrase concept - I've described that concept less accurately in
the past with words like "flowing" (I'm thinking those would be long
phrases) or I've simply described where there is some punctuation or asked
for something "bouncy" (those would be lots of changes, short phrases).
These are the kinds of things we talked about at the "caller musician
connection" workshop that Chrissy Fowler organised with CDSS here in Maine
last year and it was a great day and I hope for more opportunities like that
in the future and also recommend taking advantage of anything like that that
might happen wherever any of you are.
-cynthia
-----Original Message-----
From: callers-bounces(a)sharedweight.net
[mailto:callers-bounces@sharedweight.net] On Behalf Of Amy Cann
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 1:39 AM
To: Caller's discussion list
Subject: [Callers] The balance thing.
Dead silence for weeks and then a four page rant?
OK, I'm going to stop lurking and finally jump in. Brace yourself.
>> Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the A1, it
>> helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one.
>> Musicians?
I have never quite understood why *other* musicians want to know where the
balances are.
Sure, it's good to "spike" the balances in my playing, but I can do that
ANYwhere in a tune - and if I can't, I ain't no fiddler.
And sure it's good to know where the balances ARE, but I can get that by
watching the dance - and if I'm not watching the dance, then I ain't no
fiddler.
Let me posit something: what we're really talking about here is LENGTH OF
PHRASE.
The one thing I want to know from a caller: how long are the phrases that
you care about?
The balances often mark the starts or ends of a phrase, but they're not
always the actual issue.
HUH?
OK:
As both a caller and fiddler/pianist, I find with many callers (I'll get
to the exceptions later) that the fastest way to match the tune to the
dance is to say - "hey, can I see that card a sec?"
First, I get to check out everyone else's heiroglyphics, and second, I can
see what's going on faster than anyone could ever explain it to me.
And here's what I'm looking for: where do things stop?
Well, not stop, more like.."gather."
It takes 16 beats to get through an A. This is NOT the same thing as 16
steps. When you step, your weight is passing from one foot to the other.
We take LOTS of steps in contradancing, but what we also get are lots of
GATHERING moments, when we suck our weight together under us.
Circle left = /step step step step /step step step step/ -- IF the next
move is slide-left-along-the-lines.
It also can = /step step step step /step step step GATHER / -- IF the
next thing is going to be balance-the-circle.
Think about it.
Sometimes we gather ourselves, alone; sometimes in pairs, sometimes as a
four person circle or line-of-four, wavy or not, and sometimes as a
whole-room line.
(We usually do this for one of two reasons: because we're about to go the
OTHER way, or because we ARE going to go on, in a moment, in the same
direction, but we're setting up some sort of delayed-gratification thing.)
And often, without that clear gathering moment, the next thing won't work
well.
Think lines-forward-and-back: in some dances the line MUST suck itself
together, snap into formation, BEFORE moving forward, or it won't have
that satisfying clarity.
NOW, tunes have places where they continue and places where they
stop/gather too:
Sometimes they go: deedle-deedle-noodle-noodle-deedle-noodle-doodle-needle
for the whole time.
Sometimes they go: deedle noodle CHUCK, deedle noodle CHUCK, chucka
noodle chucka noodle YA CHA CHA! (hear the stops?)
Another way to think of it: 16 beats could be 123stop 123stop 12345678 or
it could be 1stop12345678910111213 stop or it could be.... you get it.
NOW, the whole reason contradancing stays fresh (this my theory, and just
my theory, but *I* believe it) is because even though the same people come
every week, and the dances have a certain number of moves, and the band
plays a limited number of tunes, the COMBINATION is never the same.
Different partner, different neighbor. Different tune/dance pairing.
Different 4+4 +8 tune layered over 8+2+2+4 dance.
Imagine doing an allemande/balance/allemande/balance sequence to a tune
that stops and starts right along WITH you. It can feel very satisfying,
neatly packaged.
Doing that same sequence while the tune keeps driving onwards? Now there's
a delicious sense of urgency, gotta-catch-up.
The better the dancers/caller/band, the more you can stretch the limits of
that kind of interplay.
HOWEVER, there are places where the dance stops/gathers, and the tune
REALLY needs to do the same.
In a group with lots of beginners, at the beginning of the night, at the
beginning of a medley:
Long-lines-forward -and-back really should have a tune that goes
1-2-3-stop, 1-2-3-stop.
Any place where it's important that couples stop swinging and get on to
the next thing.
Any place where shapes need to quickly coelesce out of thin air, do
something, and then morph quickly into a new clear shape:
Pass thru to ocean wave, Bal line , outside alle R 1/2, Bal line.
Plus specialty moves like bucksaws and zigzags, where everybody needs to
"get THERE, now STAY there, now get THERE" all at the same time or they
get in each other's way.
And there are some tunes with such good built in stops (Joys of Quebec,
the B part) that it's a crying shame to waste them on something sinuous
and connected.
I personally see it graphically. Here's a mythical dance (don't worry who
does what with whom, ok?):
A1: Bal, pull by,
alle L 1ce, alle R next 1ce
A2 Long Lines fwd & back
Swing in center
B1 Down hall lines-of-4
Back, cast off
B2 Chain
R&L back
And here's inside my head:
A // , // , - - - -
- - - -, - - - /
- - - /, - - - /
- - - - - - / /
B - - - - - - / /
- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - -,
- - - - - - - -
The A parts definitely need a tune that comes in groups of 4, or the lines
won't form and the swings will dribble into the down-the hall.
The B part could use a 16-er, if it weren't for the cast off:
since they have to come UP the hall AND cast off in one phrase, they
better do their turning around at the END of the previous 8 bars, and the
band better help them :
Down 2 3 4 TURN as a couple,
UP 2 3 4 cast off get ready to chain.
Time for a French Canadian, or maybe a march. Saut de Lapin would be
perfect.
***
Give me the card, I will pair up the tunes.
Tell me how long the phrases are -- "short and choppy in the A, long and
connected in the B," and I will pair up the tunes.
Give me a description that makes sense to YOU - "I need something that
goes UH uh uh, UH uh uh, digga digga digga digga UH uh uh" and I will grin
and match up the tunes.
Or show me with your hands, or use really good adjectives - sprightly,
brisk, sly -
- or make tune comparisons, " something a lot like La Bastringue, but not."
But tell me where all the balances are? "Beginning of A1, last 2 beats of
A2, third beat of B1 but only for the ones.." and I will smile politely
and say "can I see your card a sec?"
And, God forbid, if you call a dance like my mythical one in a community
hall full of Old-Home-Days beginners, and ask me to play the relentlessly
driving old-time tune you heard Wild Asparagus play at the
advanced-dancers night in the big city? I am gonna LIE to you, tell you I
never heard of that tune, and say, "can I see your card a sec?"
'course, with certain callers, I do EXACTLY what you tell me, 'cause you
already thought all of this out yourself, bless you, and you know who you
are.
I'll be really interested in feedback from all four people who actually
read this whole thing.
Cheers,
Amy Cann
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 08:42:50 -0400
From: Chris Weiler
Subject: Re: [Callers] The balance thing.
To: Caller's discussion list
Message-ID: <46E53BCA.7020900(a)weirdtable.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Amy Cann wrote:
> I'll be really interested in feedback from all four people who actually
> read this whole thing.
>
For those of you who didn't read all the way 'til the end, you may want
=== message truncated ===
---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.
Gale, you notated the dance correctly. A Google search for "Pining for you"
"David Smukler" took me to the dance on his website--
http://www.davidsmukler.syracusecountrydancers.org/DSS.html#pines
> Would Cross Trails be better as Square Through 2
Square Through 2 would give the dancers a hand connection that's not there in
the cross trail, yes, but even that figure can cause difficulty with less
skilled dancers. After the first pull by, dancers need to know which direction
to turn for the second one.
I'm speculating that the problem is not with the dance itself but rather in
selecting that as a dance to try out with many newer dancers on the floor. The
sequence in B2 works just fine, but if you have many people who don't know what
they're doing, you'll need to spend more time than you want explaining how this
works. (It's sort of akin to teaching a hey for four on the left diagonal at a
one-night stand. Yes, it could be done, but by the time one had finished the
lengthy instruction, a demonstration, and countless walkthroughs, you've spent
far too much time talking and the dancers are convinced that they can't do this
and why would anyone in their right mind want to do this kind of complicated
dancing anyhow... I mean, what's the point?)
In David's dance, folks need to get into the correct position with the circle
left exactly 3/4, then execute a rollaway on the side of the set to change
places with the neighbor, and then dance the cross-trail with their neighbor to
end up crossing the set to end on the correct side, progressed. Lots of
opportunities there for folks to go wrong.
I always encourage less-experienced callers to select simpler material than
their first instinct. In this, I'm echoing Ted Sannella, who stressed the KISS
principle: Keep it simple, stupid! Most callers I know, and I certainly am
counting myself in this number, have the tendency to want to call a fascinating
sequence, something with a distinct difference that'll make the dance (and, by
extension, the person who called it) stand out in memory. All well and good, up
to a point. The key thing to keep in mind is that we're there at the mic to make
it possible for dancers to dance, and most of them want to spend as much time as
possible dancing, not learning something complicated. (A workshop setting has
somewhat different ground rules, but I'm speaking at an open-to-the-public
event.) We do better, I think, to present material that can be taught quickly
and then let the dancers enjoy themselves.
My suggestion would be to save trying out such a dance for an opportunity when
you can work with a small group of experienced dancers, perhaps a gathering of
callers where folks are there explicitly to explore dances that they've never
called.
David Millstone
Pining for you and Re: the balance thing
Re: Hi Amy Ill be # 4! Thanks for the perspective .so much to think about!
Anyway on to the dance at hand
Pining for you:
By: David Smukler
I danced it a while ago and did a quick notation from the callers card
Dup Imp
A1 Gyp and Sw Neighbor
A2 LL F&B
Men Ala L 1.5
B1 Partner B&S
B2 Cir L 3/4
Roll Awy with ½ Sash. (Neigh)
(all) Cross trails
My Q is: The crux moves in B2
Would Cross Trails be better as Square Through 2
I attempted to call this dance at a caller sit-in where I try out new
dances
And could not impart to newer dancers the correct
Moves for the sequence (during the walk through) (new move for me!)
(I used up my allotted time and went on to one of those dances I know
cold)
If the move is a Square Through does the Seq. start By the Right?
(Partner pull by Rt. Face Neigh pull by Left? To A1 Gypsy .)
Now Ive used up my allotted time on S W sooooooo your thoughts please
(smile!)
thanks
Gale
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Well, I read it, with interest and delight. Thanks, Amy.
Take a dance with a hey (16 full counts of steady forward motion) and swirly
circles and gypsies and the like, all flow, and I might suggest one of those
Irish reels that some musicians love to play, wild chord progressions under a
melody that weaves its way along a sinuous track. But if it's a dance with lots
of lines F&B, circle left and right, RH star, LH star, four in line down the
center (you all DO remember that figure, don't you? it's becoming an endangered
species out there on the dance floor, I fear), balance the wave and slide, and
even that most-popular hot move these days, the balance and Petronella twirl--
use that same lilting Irish tune (or its hauntingingly beautiful cousin) and
you've got a tune working at odds with the choreography. You can dance it, but
the music surely ain't telling you what to do. The dancers balances are a
percussive punctuation, but the music is trying to keep moving on.
One of the reasons why I like French-Canadian tunes so much is that there are so
many of them that fall nicely into four bar / eight-beat phrases and those fit
many of the dances I call, especially at events where there are larger
proportions of less-experienced dancers. Flow is all very fine when you know
what you're doing and where you're flowing, but beginners are held safe by
figures where there's more hand contact (think circles, lines, stars) and less
moving about by yourself (think gypsies, do-si-do, hey) and don't get me started
about hey-for-four-on-the-left-diagonal when there are lots of people on the
floor who are still sorting out up and down, top of the hall and bottom of the
hall... So, in such situations, I like dances with a smaller vocabulary of
figures that recur as the evening progresses, with additions coming into the mix
as the evening goes along and they are surer. And those Quebecois tunes help the
progress along quite nicely, thank you. Plus they're so darned upbeat and
cheerful that the music alone brings a smile to everyone's face.
David Millstone
Lebanon, NH
Richard,
I have called the dance below (St. Louis dance) but I don't have the title
and author. I danced it in Cincinnati with Kathy Anderson calling. I
describe the pull-bys in B2 as "square thru two." (Partner balance, pull by,
Neighbor pull by to face next)
Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the A1, it
helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one. Musicians?
--Jerome
On 9/6/07, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net <
callers-request(a)sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 13:16:30 -0400
> From: "Richard Green" <richard.a.green(a)hotmail.com>
> Subject: [Callers] Can you name these dances?
> To: <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Message-ID: <BAY118-DAV13377439D7A9F2DCD68F5B2CB0(a)phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>
> St Louis Contradance
>
> Duple Improper
>
> Start wave across, Neighbor by RH, Ladies in center by LH
>
> A1 Balance Wave(4), Allemande R 1/2 way(4)
>
> Gents Almde L 3/4 to long wave(4), balance wave(4)
>
> A2 Gents Almde L 3/4(4), Swing Ptnr(12)
>
> ------
>
> B1 Ladies Allemande R 1.5(8)
>
> Swing Neighbor
>
> B2 R to Ptnr, balance(4), pull by Neighbor L(4)
>
> Do Si Do New Neighbor, form wave across
>
> --
> Jerome Grisanti
> 660-528-0858
> 660-528-0714
> http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
Thanks for the reminder of that each band has different needs. There was a reaction by you at Nomad last year when I requested a slinky sexy reel. Something about shirts being raised but that is just my foggy memory. This was an abnormal situation, a bunch of us filled in for a caller that wasn't able to make it at NOMAD. There was no time to communicate before and my newness really showed. Usually I try to talk with the band a week or two before and even provide a sample program. Your reply has reminded me to continue this process because every band is different and It is up to me to determine what the band requires for an enjoyable evening for all. My last two gigs were with the same band and all I had to do is to provide the program and they fit tunes before the dance. Working with the band is important and thanks for reminding me and the rest of the gang.
See ya on the floor,
Dan Black
----- Original Message ----
From: Amy Cann <ACann(a)putneyschool.org>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 1:38:48 AM
Subject: [Callers] The balance thing.
Dead silence for weeks and then a four page rant?
OK, I'm going to stop lurking and finally jump in. Brace yourself.
>> Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the A1, it
>> helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one.
>> Musicians?
I have never quite understood why *other* musicians want to know where the
balances are.
Sure, it's good to "spike" the balances in my playing, but I can do that
ANYwhere in a tune - and if I can't, I ain't no fiddler.
And sure it's good to know where the balances ARE, but I can get that by
watching the dance - and if I'm not watching the dance, then I ain't no
fiddler.
Let me posit something: what we're really talking about here is LENGTH OF
PHRASE.
The one thing I want to know from a caller: how long are the phrases that
you care about?
The balances often mark the starts or ends of a phrase, but they're not
always the actual issue.
HUH?
OK:
As both a caller and fiddler/pianist, I find with many callers (I'll get
to the exceptions later) that the fastest way to match the tune to the
dance is to say - "hey, can I see that card a sec?"
First, I get to check out everyone else's heiroglyphics, and second, I can
see what's going on faster than anyone could ever explain it to me.
And here's what I'm looking for: where do things stop?
Well, not stop, more like.."gather."
It takes 16 beats to get through an A. This is NOT the same thing as 16
steps. When you step, your weight is passing from one foot to the other.
We take LOTS of steps in contradancing, but what we also get are lots of
GATHERING moments, when we suck our weight together under us.
Circle left = /step step step step /step step step step/ -- IF the next
move is slide-left-along-the-lines.
It also can = /step step step step /step step step GATHER / -- IF the
next thing is going to be balance-the-circle.
Think about it.
Sometimes we gather ourselves, alone; sometimes in pairs, sometimes as a
four person circle or line-of-four, wavy or not, and sometimes as a
whole-room line.
(We usually do this for one of two reasons: because we're about to go the
OTHER way, or because we ARE going to go on, in a moment, in the same
direction, but we're setting up some sort of delayed-gratification thing.)
And often, without that clear gathering moment, the next thing won't work
well.
Think lines-forward-and-back: in some dances the line MUST suck itself
together, snap into formation, BEFORE moving forward, or it won't have
that satisfying clarity.
NOW, tunes have places where they continue and places where they
stop/gather too:
Sometimes they go: deedle-deedle-noodle-noodle-deedle-noodle-doodle-needle
for the whole time.
Sometimes they go: deedle noodle CHUCK, deedle noodle CHUCK, chucka
noodle chucka noodle YA CHA CHA! (hear the stops?)
Another way to think of it: 16 beats could be 123stop 123stop 12345678 or
it could be 1stop12345678910111213 stop or it could be.... you get it.
NOW, the whole reason contradancing stays fresh (this my theory, and just
my theory, but *I* believe it) is because even though the same people come
every week, and the dances have a certain number of moves, and the band
plays a limited number of tunes, the COMBINATION is never the same.
Different partner, different neighbor. Different tune/dance pairing.
Different 4+4 +8 tune layered over 8+2+2+4 dance.
Imagine doing an allemande/balance/allemande/balance sequence to a tune
that stops and starts right along WITH you. It can feel very satisfying,
neatly packaged.
Doing that same sequence while the tune keeps driving onwards? Now there's
a delicious sense of urgency, gotta-catch-up.
The better the dancers/caller/band, the more you can stretch the limits of
that kind of interplay.
HOWEVER, there are places where the dance stops/gathers, and the tune
REALLY needs to do the same.
In a group with lots of beginners, at the beginning of the night, at the
beginning of a medley:
Long-lines-forward -and-back really should have a tune that goes
1-2-3-stop, 1-2-3-stop.
Any place where it's important that couples stop swinging and get on to
the next thing.
Any place where shapes need to quickly coelesce out of thin air, do
something, and then morph quickly into a new clear shape:
Pass thru to ocean wave, Bal line , outside alle R 1/2, Bal line.
Plus specialty moves like bucksaws and zigzags, where everybody needs to
"get THERE, now STAY there, now get THERE" all at the same time or they
get in each other's way.
And there are some tunes with such good built in stops (Joys of Quebec,
the B part) that it's a crying shame to waste them on something sinuous
and connected.
I personally see it graphically. Here's a mythical dance (don't worry who
does what with whom, ok?):
A1: Bal, pull by,
alle L 1ce, alle R next 1ce
A2 Long Lines fwd & back
Swing in center
B1 Down hall lines-of-4
Back, cast off
B2 Chain
R&L back
And here's inside my head:
A // , // , - - - -
- - - -, - - - /
- - - /, - - - /
- - - - - - / /
B - - - - - - / /
- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - -,
- - - - - - - -
The A parts definitely need a tune that comes in groups of 4, or the lines
won't form and the swings will dribble into the down-the hall.
The B part could use a 16-er, if it weren't for the cast off:
since they have to come UP the hall AND cast off in one phrase, they
better do their turning around at the END of the previous 8 bars, and the
band better help them :
Down 2 3 4 TURN as a couple,
UP 2 3 4 cast off get ready to chain.
Time for a French Canadian, or maybe a march. Saut de Lapin would be
perfect.
***
Give me the card, I will pair up the tunes.
Tell me how long the phrases are -- "short and choppy in the A, long and
connected in the B," and I will pair up the tunes.
Give me a description that makes sense to YOU - "I need something that
goes UH uh uh, UH uh uh, digga digga digga digga UH uh uh" and I will grin
and match up the tunes.
Or show me with your hands, or use really good adjectives - sprightly,
brisk, sly -
- or make tune comparisons, " something a lot like La Bastringue, but not."
But tell me where all the balances are? "Beginning of A1, last 2 beats of
A2, third beat of B1 but only for the ones.." and I will smile politely
and say "can I see your card a sec?"
And, God forbid, if you call a dance like my mythical one in a community
hall full of Old-Home-Days beginners, and ask me to play the relentlessly
driving old-time tune you heard Wild Asparagus play at the
advanced-dancers night in the big city? I am gonna LIE to you, tell you I
never heard of that tune, and say, "can I see your card a sec?"
'course, with certain callers, I do EXACTLY what you tell me, 'cause you
already thought all of this out yourself, bless you, and you know who you
are.
I'll be really interested in feedback from all four people who actually
read this whole thing.
Cheers,
Amy Cann
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I'd do a nice set of polkas - like the Ballydesmond Polkas. For the
more Old Timey minded, Rock the Cradle Joe or perhaps Grub Springs
could work.
Martha
On Sep 9, 2007, at 9:00 AM, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net wrote:
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> 1. Re: Can you name these dances? (Jerome Grisanti)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 09:46:50 -0500
> From: "Jerome Grisanti" <jerome.grisanti(a)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Callers] Can you name these dances?
> To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
> Message-ID:
> <78dbc7c60709090746k177d339bpb0d025b15748e934(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Richard,
>
> I have called the dance below (St. Louis dance) but I don't have
> the title
> and author. I danced it in Cincinnati with Kathy Anderson calling. I
> describe the pull-bys in B2 as "square thru two." (Partner balance,
> pull by,
> Neighbor pull by to face next)
>
> Because there are balances both at the top and the bottom of the
> A1, it
> helps to have an appropriate tune. I wish I could recommend one.
> Musicians?
>
> --Jerome
>
>
> On 9/6/07, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net <
> callers-request(a)sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 13:16:30 -0400
>> From: "Richard Green" <richard.a.green(a)hotmail.com>
>> Subject: [Callers] Can you name these dances?
>> To: <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
>> Message-ID: <BAY118-DAV13377439D7A9F2DCD68F5B2CB0(a)phx.gbl>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>>
>>
>> St Louis Contradance
>>
>> Duple Improper
>>
>> Start wave across, Neighbor by RH, Ladies in center by LH
>>
>> A1 Balance Wave(4), Allemande R 1/2 way(4)
>>
>> Gents Almde L 3/4 to long wave(4), balance wave(4)
>>
>> A2 Gents Almde L 3/4(4), Swing Ptnr(12)
>>
>> ------
>>
>> B1 Ladies Allemande R 1.5(8)
>>
>> Swing Neighbor
>>
>> B2 R to Ptnr, balance(4), pull by Neighbor L(4)
>>
>> Do Si Do New Neighbor, form wave across
>>
>> --
>> Jerome Grisanti
>> 660-528-0858
>> 660-528-0714
>> http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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>
> End of Callers Digest, Vol 37, Issue 6
> **************************************
